Question:
Caloric deficit, dirty diet: what happens?
Can someone give me a run-through on the logic behind good nutrition?
What would happen, for example, if I had a 200 calorie deficit every day, and I continued to work out, but instead of eating a lot of protein and staying away from bad foods, I got all my calories from Pizza Hut, fettuccine Alfredo, and ice cream?
What about if I got my protein, but ate sugar instead of dietary fiber and "bad' fats instead of "good"?
I've been craving pastas and cheeses for months and my house is stocked with all of the things I want to eat. I am so tempted...
once protein requirements and your EFA needs are met, the rest becomes largely insignifcant wrt to body compostion. In a diet with identical calories and macro ratios but one is 'clean' and the other is 'dirty' any body comp differences would be negligable. Thats not to say one isnt superior though.
A diet that is 'clean' and includes veggies/fruits/good fats and carb choices is going to provide much better micronutrients to help with health and body functioning. It will also be alot more satiating than eating junk.
Then again im not suggesting you choose one or the other. A combination of the two is, IMO, the best option. You cover your nutritional needs by eating the majority of your calories throguh healthy sopurces to ensure your getting fibre/vitamins/minerals etc and once those needs are covered, if you have a 'treat' of a few hundred 'dirty' calories that still fit your macro's that is fine.
I feel this is a great way to approach nutrition as it doesnt completely remove foods from ones diet and label them as out of bounds. This creates cravings that can culminate in binges. By not restrciting yourself excessively, i feel your less likely to go lose control. Binges occur a lot becuase u have, for example, a cookie and then figure you have blown your diet and wont be allowed another cookie for weeks as punishment so you may aswell get as many as u can in now. This is obviosuyl not healthy.
So i liek a balance of healthy foods for the bulk of calories then allowing little treats w/in ones macros every so often to help keep things under control
as matthor said, a combination of clean/dirty would be alright. dont try and get all of your cals from dirty sources though, eating ice cream followed by other nutritionally sparse foods will only make you feel hungry for the proper nutrients your body needs
Can someone give me a run-through on the logic behind good nutrition?
What would happen, for example, if I had a 200 calorie deficit every day, and I continued to work out, but instead of eating a lot of protein and staying away from bad foods, I got all my calories from Pizza Hut, fettuccine Alfredo, and ice cream?
What about if I got my protein, but ate sugar instead of dietary fiber and "bad' fats instead of "good"?
I've been craving pastas and cheeses for months and my house is stocked with all of the things I want to eat. I am so tempted... Pay attention to what Matthor has to say...especially the part where he says to make sure you pay attention to meeting your nutrient requirements before you go off the deep end eating "whatever." You can't replace fiber with sugar and expect to have a healthy digestive tract (you'll also lose other health benefits that effect coronary health and insulin response). Sugar-laden foods (I'm talking along the lines of cake and cookies, not pineapples and bananas...) are also nutritionally barren compared to clean foods. By eating clean, you aren't just getting macronutrients like protein, carbs and fat, but you're also eating foods that are high in micronutrients (vitamins and minerals).
You need to eat a healthy amount of fiber (and all the other good stuff) and THEN you can fill the rest of your caloric target with sugar and still expect to lose weight in a way that's healthy for your body. If you do your best to meet your health needs first, you'll probably find you won't have much wiggle room to totally binge out on sugar but you'll probably have some room to have a treat every now and again, without ending up with a calorie surplus over the course of, say, a month.
I've found that so long as I'm eating mostly clean, "dirty" foods don't show up on me unless I'm somewhat lean. Right now, I can totally tell if I've been eating pizza and drinking soda because I'll bloat up and lose definition...and I can tell for several days afterward. But when I weigh closer to 140 (remember, I'm several inches shorter than you so I'm not saying you should weigh any less than what you do!), dirty carbs don't show up on me because I've got enough fat on me that I'm not very defined anyway. So...when I'm bulking, I indulge in dirty foods more than when I'm trying to lean out, simply because I know I'm eating enough to take care of my nutritional needs and that extra cookie on top ain't gonna make me puff up any. :)
Another thing you have to be careful about is that eating (processed) sugar all the time can make you CRAVE sugar all the time, which can really backfire on you. Some people are more prone to that than others. I personally can't even consume much fake sugar without it giving me the munchies. So be careful about that, too.
once protein requirements and your EFA needs are met, the rest becomes largely insignifcant wrt to body compostion. In a diet with identical calories and macro ratios but one is 'clean' and the other is 'dirty' any body comp differences would be negligable. Thats not to say one isnt superior though.
A diet that is 'clean' and includes veggies/fruits/good fats and carb choices is going to provide much better micronutrients to help with health and body functioning. It will also be alot more satiating than eating junk.
Then again im not suggesting you choose one or the other. A combination of the two is, IMO, the best option. You cover your nutritional needs by eating the majority of your calories throguh healthy sopurces to ensure your getting fibre/vitamins/minerals etc and once those needs are covered, if you have a 'treat' of a few hundred 'dirty' calories that still fit your macro's that is fine.
I feel this is a great way to approach nutrition as it doesnt completely remove foods from ones diet and label them as out of bounds. This creates cravings that can culminate in binges. By not restrciting yourself excessively, i feel your less likely to go lose control. Binges occur a lot becuase u have, for example, a cookie and then figure you have blown your diet and wont be allowed another cookie for weeks as punishment so you may aswell get as many as u can in now. This is obviosuyl not healthy.
So i liek a balance of healthy foods for the bulk of calories then allowing little treats w/in ones macros every so often to help keep things under control Thanks for the clarification! I am relieved that I haven't totally screwed myself of great progress by allowing myself occasional treats that fit into my macro's.
If you're getting ALL your calories from junk, it's going to be pretty hard to keep a caloric deficit due to lack of energy.
Pay attention to what Matthor has to say...especially the part where he says to make sure you pay attention to meeting your nutrient requirements before you go off the deep end eating "whatever." You can't replace fiber with sugar and expect to have a healthy digestive tract (you'll also lose other health benefits that effect coronary health and insulin response). Sugar-laden foods (I'm talking along the lines of cake and cookies, not pineapples and bananas...) are also nutritionally barren compared to clean foods. By eating clean, you aren't just getting macronutrients like protein, carbs and fat, but you're also eating foods that are high in micronutrients (vitamins and minerals).
You need to eat a healthy amount of fiber (and all the other good stuff) and THEN you can fill the rest of your caloric target with sugar and still expect to lose weight in a way that's healthy for your body. If you do your best to meet your health needs first, you'll probably find you won't have much wiggle room to totally binge out on sugar but you'll probably have some room to have a treat every now and again, without ending up with a calorie surplus over the course of, say, a month.
I've found that so long as I'm eating mostly clean, "dirty" foods don't show up on me unless I'm somewhat lean. Right now, I can totally tell if I've been eating pizza and drinking soda because I'll bloat up and lose definition...and I can tell for several days afterward. But when I weigh closer to 140 (remember, I'm several inches shorter than you so I'm not saying you should weigh any less than what you do!), dirty carbs don't show up on me because I've got enough fat on me that I'm not very defined anyway. So...when I'm bulking, I indulge in dirty foods more than when I'm trying to lean out, simply because I know I'm eating enough to take care of my nutritional needs and that extra cookie on top ain't gonna make me puff up any. :)
Another thing you have to be careful about is that eating (processed) sugar all the time can make you CRAVE sugar all the time, which can really backfire on you. Some people are more prone to that than others. I personally can't even consume much fake sugar without it giving me the munchies. So be careful about that, too.
Thanks, that makes a lot of sense. I also notice that the more junk I eat, the more of it I crave, esp. with sweets. And pasta. It's like a sickness. It's why I don't allow myself total cheat days anymore: too hard to stop.
If you're getting ALL your calories from junk, it's going to be pretty hard to keep a caloric deficit due to lack of energy. :confused:
If you're getting ALL your calories from junk, it's going to be pretty hard to keep a caloric deficit due to lack of energy. I don't (though that's how I lived for 2 years before I started lifting... except I didn't watch how much I was eating, either). I was just wondering what, potentially, would happen. I know it's not healthy. I guess I'd become malnourished and very disgustingly skinny-fat.
I know it's not healthy. I guess I'd become malnourished and very disgustingly skinny-fat. becoming skinny-fat has more to do with too much excercise (cardio) combined with too-low calorie diet and inadequate protein intake.
as pointed out, 'health' and 'fat loss' aren't the same thing. if you're overall at a negative energy balance, you're at a negative energy balance, regardless what sources you get your energy from.
Thanks, that makes a lot of sense. I also notice that the more junk I eat, the more of it I crave, esp. with sweets. And pasta. It's like a sickness. It's why I don't allow myself total cheat days anymore: too hard to stop. Totally in agreement with that logic. :)
as pointed out, 'health' and 'fat loss' aren't the same thing. if you're overall at a negative energy balance, you're at a negative energy balance, regardless what sources you get your energy from
can one still accomplish FAT LOSS with minimal protein? is a clean calorie deficit enough for fat loss or is protein essential?
I think every"body" is different.....you need to see what it does to your body...AND....you need to be in tune with your body in order to see this.
I did just what you are talking about for 3 weeks while I have my brother in town living with me....I didn't get my maint. calories...and I ate like chit.
I lost 7 lbs.....leaned out nicely though......and I felt tired....
I have decided that I was taking the whole "diet" thing too seriously..as I don't plan to become a competitive lifter or bodybuilder....It was good, however, because now I know what my normal foods consist of in the way of Protein/Carbs/Cal/Fat...and I know how much I need to eat. I aim for my maintenance calories.....avoid fast food like the plague....don't drink soda or over the counter juices (sugar).....and eat often.....for me that works based on my goals...
You need to know your body, know your goals, and adjust as needed. My opinion only of course.
can one still accomplish FAT LOSS with minimal protein? is a clean calorie deficit enough for fat loss or is protein essential? define 'minimal' protein intake. you break down and replace about 60-80 grams of body protein daily. you need to replace it to maintain nitrogen balance, even if eating at maintenance. protein is always essential. you need more of it when cutting to further prevent protein catabolism because more of it is being used for energy production.
Thanks, that makes a lot of sense. I also notice that the more junk I eat, the more of it I crave, esp. with sweets. And pasta. It's like a sickness. It's why I don't allow myself total cheat days anymore: too hard to stop. That's because sugar (and foods that convert into sugar, like refined carbs) increases the candida growth in your intestinal tract. The more candida in your tract, the more it needs to be fed, the more you crave sugar, and so on.
It's also why you tend to feel tired and crappy the first week or two of a clean diet. The candida is dying off and once it reaches a lower level, the cravings go away.
I've noticed that a few doses of a yeast-killing supplement (I got some at GNC) really does the trick in helping control cravings and get past the clean-food hump.
That's because sugar (and foods that convert into sugar, like refined carbs) increases the candida growth in your intestinal tract. The more candida in your tract, the more it needs to be fed, the more you crave sugar, and so on. doesn't that only apply if one has a problem with candida? :confused:
all carbohydrates are converted into glucose, regardless whether they're 'refined' or not.
Can someone give me a run-through on the logic behind good nutrition?
What would happen, for example, if I had a 200 calorie deficit every day, and I continued to work out, but instead of eating a lot of protein and staying away from bad foods, I got all my calories from Pizza Hut, fettuccine Alfredo, and ice cream?
What about if I got my protein, but ate sugar instead of dietary fiber and "bad' fats instead of "good"?
I've been craving pastas and cheeses for months and my house is stocked with all of the things I want to eat. I am so tempted...
Answer:
once protein requirements and your EFA needs are met, the rest becomes largely insignifcant wrt to body compostion. In a diet with identical calories and macro ratios but one is 'clean' and the other is 'dirty' any body comp differences would be negligable. Thats not to say one isnt superior though.
A diet that is 'clean' and includes veggies/fruits/good fats and carb choices is going to provide much better micronutrients to help with health and body functioning. It will also be alot more satiating than eating junk.
Then again im not suggesting you choose one or the other. A combination of the two is, IMO, the best option. You cover your nutritional needs by eating the majority of your calories throguh healthy sopurces to ensure your getting fibre/vitamins/minerals etc and once those needs are covered, if you have a 'treat' of a few hundred 'dirty' calories that still fit your macro's that is fine.
I feel this is a great way to approach nutrition as it doesnt completely remove foods from ones diet and label them as out of bounds. This creates cravings that can culminate in binges. By not restrciting yourself excessively, i feel your less likely to go lose control. Binges occur a lot becuase u have, for example, a cookie and then figure you have blown your diet and wont be allowed another cookie for weeks as punishment so you may aswell get as many as u can in now. This is obviosuyl not healthy.
So i liek a balance of healthy foods for the bulk of calories then allowing little treats w/in ones macros every so often to help keep things under control
Answer:
as matthor said, a combination of clean/dirty would be alright. dont try and get all of your cals from dirty sources though, eating ice cream followed by other nutritionally sparse foods will only make you feel hungry for the proper nutrients your body needs
Answer:
Can someone give me a run-through on the logic behind good nutrition?
What would happen, for example, if I had a 200 calorie deficit every day, and I continued to work out, but instead of eating a lot of protein and staying away from bad foods, I got all my calories from Pizza Hut, fettuccine Alfredo, and ice cream?
What about if I got my protein, but ate sugar instead of dietary fiber and "bad' fats instead of "good"?
I've been craving pastas and cheeses for months and my house is stocked with all of the things I want to eat. I am so tempted... Pay attention to what Matthor has to say...especially the part where he says to make sure you pay attention to meeting your nutrient requirements before you go off the deep end eating "whatever." You can't replace fiber with sugar and expect to have a healthy digestive tract (you'll also lose other health benefits that effect coronary health and insulin response). Sugar-laden foods (I'm talking along the lines of cake and cookies, not pineapples and bananas...) are also nutritionally barren compared to clean foods. By eating clean, you aren't just getting macronutrients like protein, carbs and fat, but you're also eating foods that are high in micronutrients (vitamins and minerals).
You need to eat a healthy amount of fiber (and all the other good stuff) and THEN you can fill the rest of your caloric target with sugar and still expect to lose weight in a way that's healthy for your body. If you do your best to meet your health needs first, you'll probably find you won't have much wiggle room to totally binge out on sugar but you'll probably have some room to have a treat every now and again, without ending up with a calorie surplus over the course of, say, a month.
I've found that so long as I'm eating mostly clean, "dirty" foods don't show up on me unless I'm somewhat lean. Right now, I can totally tell if I've been eating pizza and drinking soda because I'll bloat up and lose definition...and I can tell for several days afterward. But when I weigh closer to 140 (remember, I'm several inches shorter than you so I'm not saying you should weigh any less than what you do!), dirty carbs don't show up on me because I've got enough fat on me that I'm not very defined anyway. So...when I'm bulking, I indulge in dirty foods more than when I'm trying to lean out, simply because I know I'm eating enough to take care of my nutritional needs and that extra cookie on top ain't gonna make me puff up any. :)
Another thing you have to be careful about is that eating (processed) sugar all the time can make you CRAVE sugar all the time, which can really backfire on you. Some people are more prone to that than others. I personally can't even consume much fake sugar without it giving me the munchies. So be careful about that, too.
Answer:
once protein requirements and your EFA needs are met, the rest becomes largely insignifcant wrt to body compostion. In a diet with identical calories and macro ratios but one is 'clean' and the other is 'dirty' any body comp differences would be negligable. Thats not to say one isnt superior though.
A diet that is 'clean' and includes veggies/fruits/good fats and carb choices is going to provide much better micronutrients to help with health and body functioning. It will also be alot more satiating than eating junk.
Then again im not suggesting you choose one or the other. A combination of the two is, IMO, the best option. You cover your nutritional needs by eating the majority of your calories throguh healthy sopurces to ensure your getting fibre/vitamins/minerals etc and once those needs are covered, if you have a 'treat' of a few hundred 'dirty' calories that still fit your macro's that is fine.
I feel this is a great way to approach nutrition as it doesnt completely remove foods from ones diet and label them as out of bounds. This creates cravings that can culminate in binges. By not restrciting yourself excessively, i feel your less likely to go lose control. Binges occur a lot becuase u have, for example, a cookie and then figure you have blown your diet and wont be allowed another cookie for weeks as punishment so you may aswell get as many as u can in now. This is obviosuyl not healthy.
So i liek a balance of healthy foods for the bulk of calories then allowing little treats w/in ones macros every so often to help keep things under control Thanks for the clarification! I am relieved that I haven't totally screwed myself of great progress by allowing myself occasional treats that fit into my macro's.
Answer:
If you're getting ALL your calories from junk, it's going to be pretty hard to keep a caloric deficit due to lack of energy.
Answer:
Pay attention to what Matthor has to say...especially the part where he says to make sure you pay attention to meeting your nutrient requirements before you go off the deep end eating "whatever." You can't replace fiber with sugar and expect to have a healthy digestive tract (you'll also lose other health benefits that effect coronary health and insulin response). Sugar-laden foods (I'm talking along the lines of cake and cookies, not pineapples and bananas...) are also nutritionally barren compared to clean foods. By eating clean, you aren't just getting macronutrients like protein, carbs and fat, but you're also eating foods that are high in micronutrients (vitamins and minerals).
You need to eat a healthy amount of fiber (and all the other good stuff) and THEN you can fill the rest of your caloric target with sugar and still expect to lose weight in a way that's healthy for your body. If you do your best to meet your health needs first, you'll probably find you won't have much wiggle room to totally binge out on sugar but you'll probably have some room to have a treat every now and again, without ending up with a calorie surplus over the course of, say, a month.
I've found that so long as I'm eating mostly clean, "dirty" foods don't show up on me unless I'm somewhat lean. Right now, I can totally tell if I've been eating pizza and drinking soda because I'll bloat up and lose definition...and I can tell for several days afterward. But when I weigh closer to 140 (remember, I'm several inches shorter than you so I'm not saying you should weigh any less than what you do!), dirty carbs don't show up on me because I've got enough fat on me that I'm not very defined anyway. So...when I'm bulking, I indulge in dirty foods more than when I'm trying to lean out, simply because I know I'm eating enough to take care of my nutritional needs and that extra cookie on top ain't gonna make me puff up any. :)
Another thing you have to be careful about is that eating (processed) sugar all the time can make you CRAVE sugar all the time, which can really backfire on you. Some people are more prone to that than others. I personally can't even consume much fake sugar without it giving me the munchies. So be careful about that, too.
Thanks, that makes a lot of sense. I also notice that the more junk I eat, the more of it I crave, esp. with sweets. And pasta. It's like a sickness. It's why I don't allow myself total cheat days anymore: too hard to stop.
Answer:
If you're getting ALL your calories from junk, it's going to be pretty hard to keep a caloric deficit due to lack of energy. :confused:
Answer:
If you're getting ALL your calories from junk, it's going to be pretty hard to keep a caloric deficit due to lack of energy. I don't (though that's how I lived for 2 years before I started lifting... except I didn't watch how much I was eating, either). I was just wondering what, potentially, would happen. I know it's not healthy. I guess I'd become malnourished and very disgustingly skinny-fat.
Answer:
I know it's not healthy. I guess I'd become malnourished and very disgustingly skinny-fat. becoming skinny-fat has more to do with too much excercise (cardio) combined with too-low calorie diet and inadequate protein intake.
as pointed out, 'health' and 'fat loss' aren't the same thing. if you're overall at a negative energy balance, you're at a negative energy balance, regardless what sources you get your energy from.
Answer:
Thanks, that makes a lot of sense. I also notice that the more junk I eat, the more of it I crave, esp. with sweets. And pasta. It's like a sickness. It's why I don't allow myself total cheat days anymore: too hard to stop. Totally in agreement with that logic. :)
Answer:
as pointed out, 'health' and 'fat loss' aren't the same thing. if you're overall at a negative energy balance, you're at a negative energy balance, regardless what sources you get your energy from
can one still accomplish FAT LOSS with minimal protein? is a clean calorie deficit enough for fat loss or is protein essential?
Answer:
I think every"body" is different.....you need to see what it does to your body...AND....you need to be in tune with your body in order to see this.
I did just what you are talking about for 3 weeks while I have my brother in town living with me....I didn't get my maint. calories...and I ate like chit.
I lost 7 lbs.....leaned out nicely though......and I felt tired....
I have decided that I was taking the whole "diet" thing too seriously..as I don't plan to become a competitive lifter or bodybuilder....It was good, however, because now I know what my normal foods consist of in the way of Protein/Carbs/Cal/Fat...and I know how much I need to eat. I aim for my maintenance calories.....avoid fast food like the plague....don't drink soda or over the counter juices (sugar).....and eat often.....for me that works based on my goals...
You need to know your body, know your goals, and adjust as needed. My opinion only of course.
Answer:
can one still accomplish FAT LOSS with minimal protein? is a clean calorie deficit enough for fat loss or is protein essential? define 'minimal' protein intake. you break down and replace about 60-80 grams of body protein daily. you need to replace it to maintain nitrogen balance, even if eating at maintenance. protein is always essential. you need more of it when cutting to further prevent protein catabolism because more of it is being used for energy production.
Answer:
Thanks, that makes a lot of sense. I also notice that the more junk I eat, the more of it I crave, esp. with sweets. And pasta. It's like a sickness. It's why I don't allow myself total cheat days anymore: too hard to stop. That's because sugar (and foods that convert into sugar, like refined carbs) increases the candida growth in your intestinal tract. The more candida in your tract, the more it needs to be fed, the more you crave sugar, and so on.
It's also why you tend to feel tired and crappy the first week or two of a clean diet. The candida is dying off and once it reaches a lower level, the cravings go away.
I've noticed that a few doses of a yeast-killing supplement (I got some at GNC) really does the trick in helping control cravings and get past the clean-food hump.
Answer:
That's because sugar (and foods that convert into sugar, like refined carbs) increases the candida growth in your intestinal tract. The more candida in your tract, the more it needs to be fed, the more you crave sugar, and so on. doesn't that only apply if one has a problem with candida? :confused:
all carbohydrates are converted into glucose, regardless whether they're 'refined' or not.